M59
The art of deception?
January 16 2015
Comments
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RHP User
10 years ago
I think if you lie about the smallest of things that can just be said . Well that leaves you thinking that everything else that maybe more important can and might be lied about too. eg: age, relationship status or even I cant make it tonight as I have to help a family member. If your tired and dont feel like going out just say that, there is no need to lie about those things. Yet I bet so many people do just that. These are simple to answer
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RHP User
10 years ago
Over the past year there have been many posts by members regarding honesty and truth. In response to the posts many people claim they never lie. I have always found this an interesting claim because studies show most people lie. For example Bella DePaulo, Ph.D., a psychologist at the University of Virginia, confirms Nietzche's assertion that the lie is a condition of life. In a 1996 study, DePaulo and her colleagues had 147 people between the ages of 18 and 71 keep a diary of all the falsehoods they told over the course of a week. Most people, she found, lie once or twice a dayโalmost as often as they snack from the refrigerator or brush their teeth. Both men and women lie in approximately a fifth of their social exchanges lasting 10 or more minutes; over the course of a week they deceive about 30 percent of those with whom they interact one-on-one. So do you agree with this research and if so what levels of deception do you find acceptable and what is a deal breaker? . I'm going to start with that I feel like I should adjust my answers at times. . But, I am not subtle, slash, tactful generally. . Stroking egos is not something I feel all that capable of. I have too many questions marching through my mind. . But yes, in the last few months in particular, because this is a question that has been raised before in the forums... I've been paying attention. I have totally become aware of the levels I feel I can't be open and honest on, for fear of offence. . I feel like I have allowed myself to be worn down and eroded at times.
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RHP User
10 years ago
Lies ,in fact I never trust a person who says that they don't lie.But it's not just the lie itself,it's the motivation behind the lie.Sometimes the truth causes harm to the other person....if the lie is just covering up a bigger deception then that is certainly not a good motivation to lie so the other wont be hurt...that's a lying layer cake..People who say they are brutally honest often use their truth as a weapon.when silence would cause less harm..,,truth is sometimes about perception,two people can have the same experience and yet perceive it quite differently....is one of them lying,or are they both telling the truth,because it is their truth....Some people are just habituated to lying,they lie simply because it is what they do....I am always puzzled by that........And sometimes silence can be a lie,saying nothing when it was important to tell a truth,is also deceptive. ..good topic OP xxFreya
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RHP User
10 years ago
So do you agree with this research and if so what levels of deception do you find acceptable and what is a deal breaker? . It is a terribly complicated question to me. And so the answer must be too, as proven by Freya. :-) . There are deceptions on many levels, some with good intentions and some with bad. . It is more the intent than the action that must come into question? There is the deal breaker. But that is not always so easy to discern. Peachy
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RHP User
10 years ago
I've always found it interesting (annoying/unbelievable) that so many people insist they never lie and are outraged by the lies of others. I simply don't believe that anyone can claim to never lie or that any one peraon's tolerance for lies (what is acceptable, what isn't) is the yardstick the rest of us should follow. We all have a line in the sand ... a point where lies become unacceptable to us. By definition therefore, we all have a point up to which some lies are tolerable. I've seen so much vitriol expressed on these forums in the past about 'people who lie' and yet when the conversation has unfolded a bit more, most of the time the outraged people have their own line in the sand - lies they'll accept v lies they won't. So to me, it all comes down to tolerance. If some lies are acceptable to me, it stands to reason that some lies (perhaps different ones, more or less serious) are acceptable to others. Any outrage I feel, therefore, is nothing more than a judgment that my line in the sand is right and the other person is wrong. Ultimately, objecting to the line in the sand that others choose (usually because it doesn't match your line in the sand) is a blatant case of self-righteousness. I'm comfortable with lies that don't hurt others, if they protect something that's important to me. That's my line in the sand. I'm also tolerant of lies told by others if they're not intended to be malicious and destructive. Some lies will hurt one person while protecting another. This is an unavoidable ethical dilemma I'm sure we all have to face at times. I think about the outrage I've read here before when people have fudged details of their profile, as though doing so is an offense to the unwritten rules of life/forums/RHP etc. My first thought when someone has fudged something on their profile is that perhaps they're protecting their identity (domestic violence maybe), their job (public profile) or their children/family (bullying/gossip). It's ridiculous to jump on people who fudge their age or whatever it might be, simply because you don't understand or are not interested in understanding their reasons. It's even more ridiculous to think that anyone owes a bunch of random strangers on this site an explanation for why they might fudge something. - Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
10 years ago
Yes! Or are we telling a lie? :p - Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
10 years ago
...three versions of the truth. Yours. Mine. And somewhere in the middle the most accurate version of the truth???
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RHP User
10 years ago
..told with malicious intent or merely to prevent hurting someone.
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On_Safari
10 years ago
I still stand by the not lying thing.....I may colour the truth or over exaggerate but really in my head THAT's how it really happened ๐ณ ๐ lol. Yes I tell wee white lies, like I have a date today at Midday that I'm hoping will lead to something but told another guy I WAS going to meet that I have a friend in need so had to reschedule. The friend in need is spending tomorrow with me. I HAD TO SAY SOMETHING!! This guy is my first Vanilla Dating Site date in 5yrs!!! and well there's something about him OP. oh God am I going to go to HELL for this???? I guess it's the nature of the lie, the level of deceit, the overall dishonesty and underlying motivation behind these lies that determines the level of disingenuineness. I loathe liars, it's true. I get into my biggest troubles by being truthful but I have also lied to save myself, control a situation until I'm ready for the truth to be told, to protect someone's feelings, to add to a surprise that's been planned and sometimes by accident due to a lack of informtion from someone else. Guess lies have to be put into context. There are shades of grey and a whole spectrum of colour in between the black and white. Do I consider myself a liar by nature? Certainly not and those who know me know it's truth. I suck at it. Do I do it if it serves a purpose? Only if it isn't catastrophic to anyone long term or hurtful. Does that make me a Saint, HELL NO!!! But I am a bit wayward. I still and do honrstly believe lies will lock you up with truth the only key.
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RHP User
10 years ago
I think we have all met people who are habitual liers and deceivers in our time, I just accept they have been doing it so long they are no longer aware to the extent that they lie. These people we don't really let into our inner circle of friends. Back on topic it is fair to say EVERYONE guilds the lilly to some extent weather it is to easy someone from the pain or hurt that we know they will get if they knew the whole story, but deception to further our own ends has never sat very well with me. I guess it gets back to what values you were raised with and the examples set in earlier years. Sorry to offend anyone named 'lilly' - Posted from rhpmobile
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Violetincredible
10 years ago
If you're looking at academic research (because that's what your quoting) most research on people has half the plan explaining how they are going to get the truth from people... Because it's a given that people have their own interpretations,agendas and are effected in What they reveal by the relationship with the researcher. In life I think it is more important to observe people, be empathic and objective to understand who they really are, check your own agenda and see if that is effecting them and look for more than the words they utter... Xxviolet
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madotara69
10 years ago
Oh by golly gosh I hope this can be understood. Tara came over sat down and said, "have you still got that pic up, why"? I said well we are talking about clitoris's and what you like me doing with yours" She said, " oh what did Funlover say he would like to do with it" I said "find it" She said "he won't have to find it" Then she skipped off. I like telling the truth, so does Tara Mado Tara xx
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RHP User
10 years ago
I'm perfect ๐ My shit is pure white and covered in sprinkles, and my farts smell like roses ๐๐๐ - Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
10 years ago
It's not a lie... if you believe it.
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Violetincredible
10 years ago
If I ignore what you wrote and look at your picture and observe you.. Then come back and reread what you wrote.. I can tell that you are lying because you look nothing like a unicorn ๐ Xxviolet (the geek)
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MsJonesy
10 years ago
Quoting 'sir_stir' I'm perfect ๐ My shit is pure white and covered in sprinkles, and my farts smell like roses ๐๐๐ - Posted from rhpmobile Its the belches we're worried about
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madotara69
10 years ago
The Alpha alicorn
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RHP User
10 years ago
My horn is getting polished which is why you can't see it ๐ - Posted from rhpmobile
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Violetincredible
10 years ago
Interesting sir stir..... Xxviolet
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RHP User
10 years ago
The truth can also be taken as a lie? Look at my sad sorry arse for example ? I tell the truth as to why I can't get to meet n greets (money is an issue) my kids (like a mother) and there needs come first long before mine? But because I can't meet people (yes I'm single father of six :) not one or two but six) people stop chatting :(( there are four lady's I once chatted with on ph but no longer do. It's sad to say the least that I'm daubed as lier when in fact I'm no different to a single mother ?? Anyway I hate how people a little to fast to place us (all males) in that group of males that lie... Fuck I'm just me I'm single and I'm a father grrr but I'll choose my baby's every time over my own needs wants and desires and I mean every time...
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6exxy
10 years ago
Given that she is going to lie to you would you still see her? I'm just asking? ๐ฏ Yep, yes uh huh I'm being lied to right now and what the hell? I might as well enjoy her lie!๐๐๐
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RHP User
10 years ago
Quoting '6exxy' Given that she is going to lie to you would you still see her? I'm just asking? ๐ฏ Yep, yes uh huh I'm being lied to right now and what the hell? I might as well enjoy her lie!๐๐๐ There are multiple conditions that must be met for a lie to be a lie. Regarding these conditions, there's one school of thought that contends the receiver of a lie must believe what they are being told is true. If the receiver recognises it as a lie, then it's not a lie (or at least a statement that is not true). Then again, if a receiver of a lie pretends that they believe a lie, even though they know it to be a lie, then some claim can be made about the deceptiveness of the receiver. (note: there is some distinction between a lie and a deception).
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RHP User
10 years ago
You dont need the research to know people lie. On the whole we humans are so much more alike than different that most of what makes us tick, ticks the same way in others. Nobody goes through life without lies, we learnt to lie very early on, some are good at it others don't do it as well. Lies only become deceit when the intent of the lie is to harm or exploit others. I know people that almost every word that comes from their mouth is a lie, they constantly talk them selves up, You say you have done something they have done it better, faster, more often. Those types of lies, though not doing the individual any good, are really harmless and I see nothing wrong with it. The fish that got away is always bigger than reality, the story is what is the interest, the facts irrelevant. This does not mean that this liar is a bad person for though they lie, they may never lie to exploit, I have found that people that lie like that seldom lie when it counts. The ones that make a big song and dance about not lying are in-fact the most dangerous. if your lies are harmless then you don't need to cover them, if you lie to exploit then it is imperative that you cover that fact. These people practice the lie, they prepare and establish the story. They do so for their own benefit at the detriment of others. Never trust one that claims they do not lie, or that they are bad at lying (bogus all humans are good liers we started even before we could talk) Some years back I set out to not lie at all, as a sort of experiment. I could omit but I could not lie. That does not work at all, we lie to protect, we lie to simplify, we lie for many reasons. Try it, go a week and not a single lie. If someone asks you how are you and yo feel like shit say so, yes your ass is big in that! no that meal was barely edible! or You are lying! we lie a lot about knowing others lies. I did it for several months, I lost friends because I did not lie. You can not function in society if you can not lie. I came to my senses, I lie, so what, but I will not lie to exploit or harm, that is where you cross the line, that is what make lies bad.
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Dryphuz
10 years ago
Never about the big things, thats how i try to live. As i get to know someone i tell less white lies too. "yep. that dress makes you look huge." I would hope everyone else is as honest with me, but I'm pretty sure the level of truthfulness varies from person to person and yo just have to deal with that fact. But i don't mind embellishment or exaggeration. Its almost required for a good story, which is why some stories seem to grow in the retelling. On a side note here's the best responses to "does this dress make me look fat?" I've ever heard... "I've seen you naked... Stop blaming it on the dress." "No... your fat makes you look fat... The dress makes you look like a prostitute." "i'll just go and sleep on the couch now shall I?" And the piece de resistance "Yes... And those heels make you look handicapped."
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Lovinit28andKC72
10 years ago
There are lies and then there are LIES...... People lie for many reasons, to save their own arses, to save someone else's arse, to be deceitful, to not hurt someone, with the intent to mislead, as so not to offend, to get what they want and because they can help it. To live in a web of lies is not only a dangerous game, but also becomes quite difficult, because you have to have an extremely good memory.... I have told and will continue to tell little lies when I need to, but I will not lie with the intent to mislead, to hurt, to be deceitful, or to be malicious. Do people really want to hear the complete truth all the time, I don't think so, even if you say you do, thats lie right there..... The only one you have to be 100% truthful with is yourself, it all just seems to fall into place when you are.....๐
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inspirit
10 years ago
Sometimes you just have too. You can't just tell some one they're "fucked in the head" anymore or that they're a "lazy bum". You have to coat it with strawberries and cream and hope the fuck you don't offend them, otherwise you're a bully. Now.....how's those RHP sizes going lads. ;-) - Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
10 years ago
Quoting 'Lovinit28' I will not lie with the intent to mislead What is the intent behind a lie if not to mislead?
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RHP User
10 years ago
There are the lies we tell ourselves,the excuses we make for our own bad behaviour and others...sometimes this is about false hope,sometimes it is because we don't want to face up to our responsibilities and sometimes it's because the truth is just so damn painful to look at it without a filter,would be a dagger to the heart, so sometimes our self deceit enables us to continue to function xxFreya
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RHP User
10 years ago
Quoting 'Lovinit28' I have told and will continue to tell little lies when I need to, but I will not lie with the intent to mislead, to hurt, to be deceitful, or to be malicious. *Nods vigorously*
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RHP User
10 years ago
Lying is, by definition, deceitful. This is where the problem begins, I think. Judging some lies OK and others not, but not accepting that different people will judge this differently. As in, there is no right or wrong, just difference and degrees. One of my favourite sayings (shared before) - the opposite of what you know is also true. - Posted from rhpmobile
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Lovinit28andKC72
10 years ago
Correct, a lie is a lie, but I stand by the fact that no one wants to hear the complete truth all of the time. I will think about what I saying and not tell the complete truth if it's going to upset or hurt a friend or family. Is that deceitful, yes I giess but I'm not doing it to benefit me, it's purly to not hurt someone I care about..... Have I lied to save face, for my benefit, to help myself? Yes of course, I'm 46, I done things I'm not that proud of, I hurt people that didn't deserve to be hurt, I've offended, I've been an out right C""t at time, but I have learnt along the way that the truth isn't always the best policy. I've grown, I've learnt, I've changed and now I actually love me and I'm completely honest with myself, which is all that truly matters. I'm an honest person, if you ask me something, chances are that I will tell you exactly what I think, unless I think that it's going to hurt or upset you in anyway, but if it's about my experiences, my life, my journey yep I'm going to be 100% honest, because there is no chance of anyone being hurt.....๐ once again this is just my opinion and I stand by it and it's how I live my life....๐
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Lovinit28andKC72
10 years ago
To mislead anyone of who I am, my beliefs, my intentions, i hope that makes it a little clearer for you. Anything else you'd like to know?
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6exxy
10 years ago
I can understand what you are saying but maybe we are over analysing this a bit. Most things are simple, people make them complicated. If someone doesn't tell the truth then it's a lie. Irrespective of whether the receiver knows or not. The receiver is just ahead of the game.
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RHP User
10 years ago
Quoting '6exxy' ...maybe we are over analysing this a bit. There's an analysis limit?
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Dryphuz
10 years ago
i prefer the cold hard truth. I've lived long enough to know how to deal with it.
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RHP User
10 years ago
...but sometimes it's just what a person needs to get by.
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RHP User
10 years ago
...an untruth is not always a lie.
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RHP User
10 years ago
I have a woman working with me..I see her when I come back off break, and ask her..."Did you miss me lovely?""Yes""OH My.. you tell the most GORGEOUS lies Girl"
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RHP User
10 years ago
Most lies I would suspect are unknown so ignorance is bliss. It's a part of living in a grown up world, if you take mortal offence at being lied too your going to end up alone very very quickly.So what is the deal breaker ? I find that really hard to answer, I have kids, I tolerate lies from them I wouldn't an adult. Lies from salespeople, politicians etc are almost de rigour. Lies from partners are the ones that really hurt, undermine trust etc the degree tolerated is a function of your own esteem/confidence and the depth to which you can understand and forgive the liar.
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Plain
10 years ago
Ok, I believe it, thousands wouldnt. I would like to see what the questions were and what scenarios they used is deception a lie or is the lie the deception. There are two different contexts here a deception can be a self fulfilling belief ergo a man in his fifties waits in a cafe and an attractive girl comes up to him and gives him a cuddle and a kiss, you hear a murmur around the room as yet there has been no words spoken between the two of them. Some people mostly women become indignant and some look on in envy mostly men. Yet perfectly innocent the girl in question is his grand daughter. The lie same scenario the man says his young bit of fluff is about to arrive( I know this is an extreme example) the same room stays silent while he announces it they have the same greeting and the same reactions. A modern day conundrum lies lies , damned lies and statistics.
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RHP User
10 years ago
I confess I just shaved three years off my age, and that's not where I live. The devil made me do it, I promise to be honest in the future. The only time I lie straight is in bed and even then its a problem for me. Oh all right then, I am a man. But that's just a little white lie.
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RHP User
10 years ago
Quoting 'Tiroba' Quoting 'Lovinit28' I will not lie with the intent to mislead What is the intent behind a lie if not to mislead? Example: I tell people I meet I live in the suburb next to mine, until I trust them enough to tell the truth. I have no intention of misleading anyone, it's something I do to keep myself safe.
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RHP User
10 years ago
Quoting 'Meander' Quoting 'Tiroba' Quoting 'Lovinit28' I will not lie with the intent to mislead What is the intent behind a lie if not to mislead? Example: I tell people I meet I live in the suburb next to mine, until I trust them enough to tell the truth. I have no intention of misleading anyone, it's something I do to keep myself safe. I've seen people say black is white in the RHP forums, so despite the smiley face, I can't tell if you're joking. Anyway, just in case you're not joking... Mislead (Collins Dictionary)1. to give false or misleading information to 2. to lead or guide in the wrong direction Miss Lead would be a good name for a Domme mistress.
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Mischeviouslad
10 years ago
Nobody ever leaves RHP They just come back as someone else.
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RHP User
10 years ago
I went to 876 fckn houses trying to find you last month....NOW you tell me I was in the WRONG suburb??You terrible terrible liar you!!!!!!
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madotara69
10 years ago
after a month jogging across the desert. Some lies are insatiable. ~grins~ Mado Mado Tara xx
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RHP User
10 years ago
For me, wouldn't necessarily be the lie - it would come down to the driving force and the intent behind the lie.
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RHP User
10 years ago
Still I would try and I say try to never lie for something important to me.......be then what could be a lie to the other could just be a softer response by me to the truth and nothing but the truth. And be honest, the truth can hurt so much......so sometimes its just nicer I say and or better to tell a " lie" That's my truth..................but this could be a total LIE
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RHP User
10 years ago
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madotara69
10 years ago
See it has not stopped you from getting a pearl necklace. Hard to bullshit about being a man with those wonderful tits. Mado Mado Tara xx
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